Thursday, July 30, 2015

Greece Tops in Teacher Pay, But Nothing Else

Anonymous said...
I don't know if this will be a new thread but here goes.

I had a chance to read through the special edition of the Rochester Business Journal today. This is the annual report on schools in Monroe County. Here are some interesting facts:

1. Greece Teachers are #1 in pay. Average: $70,000. Age/Yrs Experience 42/15. Average class size 22 students.

2. Greece ranks #19 out of 27 districts for High School Graduation rates

3. Per pupil spending = $18,791 per child.

4. Regents Dipolmas #15 out of 27 districts

5. Regents English + #22 out of 27 districts

6. Regents Math = #18 out of 27 districts

7. SAT score for Reading = #23 out of 27 districts

8. SAT score Writing = #23 out of 27 districts

9 SAT score Math = #24 out of 27 districts.

So, Greece teachers are the highest paid at $70,000 a year on average EXCLUDING benefits, but the Greece School district is NOT number one in anything else. I would like to hear all the excuses as to why our kids scores are in the toilet. Other school districts spend less on average for Teacher salaries but are getting better results. And some of these districts have similar socio economic conditions as Greece.

By the way............Pittsford comes in second in Teacher salary at $62,000 a year excluding benefits. Guess where their kids rank?     

7/29/2015 8:36 PM


Charlie Hubbard said...

You can put the blame smack dap on the school board - period.
I challenge anyone to show ONE item in the new school board approved contract that points to educational improvements - just ONE.
This school board is owned by the unions and for the unions. The recently school board approved contract is another worthless, do/nothing, give/away. It is so bad the school board even made sure the 'union' got more free money. This school board stuck their middle finger straight up to the taxpayers (and our kids) and kissed the union on their back side. The school board had NO idea what the additional cost was. I thought the Greece school board had reached an all time low for incompetence in 2004 when they gave a departing superintendent FREE LIFETIME FAMILY MEDICAL AND DENTAL with NO idea or concern about the cost. This board is trying to imitate them.
I have said many times the biggest problem with public education are incompetent school boards - I stand by that.

Anonymous said...

You are comparing apples to oranges when comparing Greece with Pittsford . In that scenario Greece is way out there beyond Pluto Does that same publication list the percentages of students qualifying for free and reduced lunches in Pittsford vs Greece. .? Number of students
Living in one parent environments? I know you don't want to hear this but those are all factors effecting student performance as well as teacher success.. Given the working conditions that exist in Pittsford opposed to those in Greece, makes $62,000 a windfall compared to the teaching environment in Greece where teachers are faced with disruptive sometimes out of control students and parents. $70.000'is no way near enough to try and teach under those conditions and be successful in both student performance and teacher success.

SCATS said...

To 2:19PM ~~ EXCUSES, EXCUSES, EXCUSES! They have the SAME "measures" for success ... or failure. And as far as we've heard, GCSD has NO PROBLEM attracting new teachers.

Anonymous said...

Come on Charlie, how about you just admit the School Board is totally a joke once they have approved the hiring of a Superintendent. NY paid off politicians gave the Unions the power to run Districts over 30 years ago.

A School Board with guts could make it difficult for the UNION, but even they couldn't set things right..

The time has come to change the name and move on. Greece Central Youth Processing and Athletic District would be accurate.

We knew as a society how to EDUCATE in the 50s. We allowed "Experts" and Union to change that in the 60s & 70s. Today we have 2 full generations of clueless "parents" who may have a Degree, but have no damn education. Even the UNION Teachers have no idea how to diagram a sentence.

The only ball that hasn't been dropped is in Athletics.

SCATS said...

To 2:27PM ~~ I agree with you at least to an extent.

I'm VERY attuned to misspellings, the misuse of words, language, etc. I'm finding an increasing number of language atrocities unleashed within local news reporting. It seems to get worse every time a new crop of recently graduated "journalists" gets hired. Nobody knows the difference between "then" and "than" any longer. It appears that NO ONE edits what comes out, either.

Worse yet, when they are unfamiliar with a word, it gets remade into two words that don't fit, or worse yet, they force what they hear into a meaning they think sounds right. Recently, the phrase "probable cause" appeared on a local TV station website. It became painfully obvious the author had NO clue about what it meant ... so as the "reporting" went on, the reporter finally came right out and stated (improperly) that the suspect "probably caused" the criminal activity! Lawsuits will be coming soon.

Anonymous said...

You forgot the one that rankles me most puttitat.

The past tense of plead is PLED, not "Pleaded".

Then again, does it really matter if she has yellow hair and nice boobs?

Anonymous said...

2:19 hit the nail on the head. Read what they wrote, there's your answer.

Anyone who has to ask this question to begin with and doesn't already know the answer does not frequent the halls of a Greece schools. Nor do they understand the correlation between socio economic status and educational success.

To Scats, very dignified response with "excuses, excuses, excuses". I'm surprised you didn't add "I know you are, but what am I" . Try listening instead of just operating on a blanket assumption that greece teachers and employees are overpaid under qualified imbilsuls.

To Charlie Hubbard, all I ever see you do is whine and cry but never once do you offer productive thoughts about how to make something better. Of course your comments are so reflective of a true lack of understanding I suppose you wouldn't know where to begin anyway. Try an ounce of humility, try listening, try pretending you don't know it all, and maybe you will go through life learning something new each day.
And if you are not up for that, well then you illustrate the point of why a teacher can be the best there is but if someone isn't willing to learn, it's a lost cause.

Anonymous said...

To 7/30/15 @ 2:19PM..........I expected this response from the Union hacks.

I grew up with an alcholic father and a mother who had serious mental health issues. Many, many times I went to school with a lunch of peanutbutter crackers and nothing else. Breakfast was one bowl of cereal using powered milk. Dinner......well it was what ever we could find in the fridge. (which was not much)
But when I was in school I was EXPECTED to learn. The teachers did not allow excuses for us to NOT learn. Yes, many times they slipped me an apple and a small carton of milk but the teachers I had were loving and kind and made sure I learned. And these teachers were probably making $10K a year and were NOT in any union!

I am so very sick of all the excuses teachers use today as to why "Johnny" can't learn. It is bullshit. For decades there have been poor kids. Hungry kids. Kids from single parent homes. Kids from dysfuntional homes. The kids who could not speak a word of English but they learned and many excelled. Get over it and teach damn it. Your excuses ring on deaf ears.

SCATS said...

To 8:33PM ~~ THANK YOU!!! Well stated.

SCATS said...

To 7:02PM ~~ Perhaps it is ONLY within the halls of Greece schools where this EXCUSE is used ... ? Hmm ... sounds right.

PS ~~ Please tell us all what the heck an "imbilsul" is. This is no mere misspelling.

Anonymous said...

To: 7:02, You say,

"...the point of why a teacher can be the best there is but if someone isn't willing to learn, it's a lost cause."

7/30/2015 7:02 PM

How can a teacher [be shown to] be the best there is... if students aren't learning for whatever reason?

And, why pay extra if there is no extra benefit?

Anonymous said...

To 7/30/15 @ 2:19pm.............So you are complaining about the number of kids who get free or reduced lunches and breakfast in Greece compared to Pittsford? Another bullshit EXCUSE! Kids who get free/reduced breakfast and lunch in Greece schools ARE NOT going HUNGRY. This means they are getting fed and do not sit in YOUR CLASSROOM hungry and "unable to learn." Their bellies are full and brains intact ready to learn. Teach them damn it!

Charlie Hubbard said...

to 7:02 (anonymous)
You can't 'fix' a problem until you first admit there 'is' a problem.
In the case of Greece there are NO problems with educational results - we know this because the school board and administration approved another contract that holds no one accountable for nothing - NOTHING.
I have never blamed the teachers or the unions. I have always put the responsibility on the administration and the board. It is 'they' who are saying there are no problems - no improvements are necessary. So you want me to offer up solutions (which you know I have) to 'fix' problems when those in charge have made clear do not exist.

SCATS said...


To 7:38AM ~~ They (the union) have "reasons" for failing despite what's happening.

To Charlie ~~ Let's not forget that YOU did provide a "fix" to the contract issue with a new policy!! Now the BOE ignores it!!

As for the notion that so many students "don't want to learn" I suggest we begin interviewing each new student at the Pre-K or K level regarding their enthusiasm/desire to go to school. I have yet to EVER meet a 5 yr. old who wasn't thrilled to start school with the other "big boys and girls." Then let's track that student ... quarterly along with progress reports/grades. Let's determine WHERE, WHEN & WHY these kids become disinterested in school. Then when we learn it is because the school system has snuffed out their desire, we can attempt to "fix" that. Perhaps there are some teachers who aren't doing what they should ;)

Anonymous said...

"...the point of why a teacher can be the best there is but if someone isn't willing to learn, it's a lost cause."

Well, the horse crap over teacher's ability to teach isn't dictated by the amount of monies they receive at all. "if someone isn't willing to learn, it's a lost cause."

Anonymous said...

Our police are the highest paid in the county I believe so why not the teachers. Residents are the fools who sit back and do nothing. Voice your opinion and someone needs to tell the unions enough is enough and the gravy train is over.

Anonymous said...

To 7:38: fascinating to see people put comments like this right out there in print. It really shows you have no understanding of the meaning of free and reduced lunch. That is the SYMPTOM, not the PROBLEM.

Free and reduced lunch means much more than hungry kids, it is reflective of kids growing up in poverty. And poverty means more than not having money to go to Disney World. Poverty quite often entails single incomes....lack of family stability, lack of family resources, role models, supports, education levels, and many other essentials that make or break a child's desire to learn, ability to engage, ability to receive the crucial family support necessary in their education,etc. While this is neither an excuse nor an across the board generalization, it is often the case. Free and reduced lunch is an indicator of this. Its much more than just a kid not getting Cheerios before he heads out the door.

If you still don't believe me, spend some time in the City School District, watch how many students function, then do the same in pittsford. What you will surely notice is the readiness level for learning with many city students is not even close to where it needs to be for that student to learn. City teachers fault? Are teachers in the city that much more inept at educating students than Pittsford as test scores and graduation rates might suggest? Hardly. These students are battling poverty, and all that goes along with it.
And as you can guess, the "free and reduced lunch" in the city is sky high. Yes there are students who overcome. But the battle is much greater and more than any Pittsford student could ever even fathom.

So understand the greater picture. The population has changed in Greece over the last 10-15 years, and the INDICATOR of that is the free and reduced lunch. As a result, comparing the challenges that Greece teachers face vs Pittsford is apples and oranges. They work just as harder, perhaps harder. Don't fool yourself into thinking you are not getting the bang for your buck that you are entitled to as a tax payer. If you are doing your role as a supportive parent to your child, Im guessing your child is doing quite fine.
Meanwhile, the judgement should stop until you have walked in other people's shoes.

SCATS said...

To 12:33PM ~~ I've volunteered in the schools. I've seen what comes & goes. I've also seen & heard Greece teachers "respond" ... or more often FAIL TO RESPOND, especially in the area of student discipline. And I'm talking from K-5 right on up the line.

No, Greece taxpayers do NOT get the 'bang for the buck' they deserve. When GCSD (admin. AND teachers) decides to do something meaningful to REMOVE THOSE NONRESIDENT STUDENTS then we can talk. Until then, our district is a JOKE and the taxpayers are the butt of it.

Anonymous said...

To: 12:33pm

You say, "Don't fool yourself into thinking you are not getting the bang for your buck that you are entitled to as a tax payer."

Question: If taxpayers in general (county wide) get... 'average bang for average buck', then are you suggesting Greece taxpayers are entitled to get... 'above average bang for above average buck'?

And within Greece, are above average bucks paid out to above average teachers?

Anonymous said...

Is Degnin still on GCSD payroll "Investigating" nonresident students?

Seems he got a fat check and couldn't find his ass with both hands.

Apathy has won. Get used to it.

We have Captain Kirk at the Highway Department creating fear by firing men who know their jobs so the rest stay quiet & play nice. See how good Greece roads are because of it?

Charlie Hubbard said...

Ms. Jones misses 100 days of school last year. 50% of her students fail her class. Big money is being spent for 3 maybe 4 subs not to mention the lack of instructional stability - 'by contract' Ms. Jones gets another raise. Anyone think the kids don't see this? Anyone think the kids would think 'this' is how the world operates? The 'real' world not public education.
The REAL problem - your school board and administration agrees with this.

SCATS said...

To Charlie ~~ We'll NEVER see GCSD flaunt their teacher attendance numbers ;)

Anonymous said...

I got no dang ideer why everybudy so dang mad at Greec Skewlz.
I graduatd from GC back in 94 and had me a job delivering stoves & washin machines a week after. I been with that company ever since and I make good money. My odlist boy graduatd this yeer and wasn't a week till he found decent and respectable work selling Squatty potty door to door in Greece. Tell you waht, that there squatty thing brings a whole new measure of pleasure to yer daily movements.
Hadnta bin for Greece Sentrul I got no idea where are family wood be.

Anonymous said...

7:38 Assuming that we have food stamps in every home that need them therefore there should be an ample supply of proper food for the child agreed. I have seen poverty around the world smelled it, heard it, seen it and, I do not see many living in poverty in this country except maybe the guys living under the bridge but they still are not picking through garbage dumps looking for anything edible. You are just letting parents abdicate the responsibility for their children to someone else. The problem is not hunger it is crappy parenting. There are winners and losers in like like it or not. We would be farther ahead writing the current crop of losers off and resign ourselves to the fact that we are going to have to support them for life focusing our efforts on the next generation. If the children are not properly cared for take them out of the environment and place them into a proper place for suitable care and rearing. It has got to be cheaper and more effective than what we are doing now. Personally I know several very successful people that came out of St. Josephs Villa and the Hillside system. You are probably a teacher and are much smarter that me sorry that I butted in.

SCATS said...

To 2:01PM ~~ There are a RECORD number receiving food stamp benefits these days, so your assumption is likely accurate.

Why would you think a teacher was "smarter" than you?? YOU PAY THEIR WAY, so don't be sorry for your opinion, EVER.

Anonymous said...

Where does the Athletic District rate on Gay, Lesbian, and flat not sure District support?
Is there still a Support Group for the Confused Crowd led by a staff Lesbian?

I wonder why the kids are so damn confused.

Anonymous said...

Rumors regarding GCSD version of NASCAR silly season have begun... summer project work woefully late, illegal and unfair hiring practice accusations(both past and current), reassignments with no regard to seniority, and site changes affecting operation. I foresee a banner year for SCAT's!!!

SCATS said...

To 3:40PM ~~ Every year is a banner year because this is Greece NY ... where everyone is slippery ;)

Anonymous said...

The Greece school district is terrible. Many have chosen to send their kids to Catholic schools this year. Many reasons behind that. Athena is going down hill very fast, security guards at all practices since items are being stolen and the teachers are just turning the other way and letting kids do whatever they want. It is simply awful how the district is. Put the kids back in their home schools and not allow this school of choice to go on. Athena would then not be over crowded and many of the riff raff would not be there. If parents want the kids to go to Athena then live in that district. Teachers moving out f the district so they don't have to send their kids to the school - simply amazing and a tell tale sign of how bad the district is.

Recent alumni and their parent are so happy that they don't have to deal with the school anymore. That is just a sad state of affairs.