Thursday, November 07, 2013

Athena Violence Doesn't Faze Principal


From A Facebook Friend:

"So there have been 7 fights at Athena today with lock downs and one invlived the use of box cutters. Security was called in from Olympia to help< YET 8 minutes ago the principal in on FB updating it with Senior trip pictures????? WTF"

44 comments:

Ben Campanelli said...

no doubt the fights are in the style of Greco-Roman rastling

Anonymous said...

Please get the facts right. No weapons were involved and there were 4 fights. Social media spreading false "truths" again.

Anonymous said...

THEY DON'T CARE!! Do you understand that statement. They only care about getting their big fat paychecks. The accountability aspect is not there. These kids know that when it comes to dicipline that most of the time nothing happens but a slap on the hand. Then they go back and brag to their friends how they got away with it. When is the district going to stop bowing down to these kids and their PARENTS???

Anonymous said...

One has to ask oneself... "Is this really the District where I want my kids to be educated?" The decisions made today to pull security from other buildings(leaving those facilities understaffed), Principals from those same schools called in to provide support(another move leaving facilities understaffed),and the inability of Jason(I started my leadership tenure by planking with students)Gianotti to exercise any control for the past 3 years here, are dangerous decisions made by the absent Super and further acknowledgement of Chatterton's ability to repeat Knaack's numerous mistakes of the past. Whoever that security supervisor(you know him... the one that dresses like he's Hulk Hogan and everyone makes fun of) at Athena must be so proud of his and his teams ability to maintain a safe environment! Or, maybe he just really sucks at doing his job and would rather buy into following the Athena mantra of sweeping everything under the rug so he continues to collect a paycheck for doing nothing! I say, It's time for housecleaning at Athena - The last three years are loaded with miscues by Supervision at Athena... Bus Monitors, gang fights in parking lots, weapons, drug dealers robbed in gym locker rooms, 5 vehicles crashed by a student, etc.

SCATS said...

To 5:48PM ~~ I was warned in advance to expect your claim ;)

By the way, we're supposed to be satisfied that there were "only 4 fights", right??

Anonymous said...

4 fights.....no knives. Sorry SCATS it isn't the "story" that you wanted. The district was VERY responsive. Check your facts!

Anonymous said...

Once again, SCATS you were not there, and continue to spread incorrect information.

Anonymous said...

According to a conversation overheard between Athena students, "they F'in retarded, they think there was only 4 fights today, but really there was 9!"

SCATS said...

To 7:46 & 7:52PM ~~ I posted info I received privately from a named source who is in a position to know. Saying it ain't so, doesn't make it wrong. You offered NO PROOF at all, just a lot of wind.

AGAIN, I'm amazed you rather nitpick the details than discuss the bigger ISSUES: MULTIPLE FIGHTS @Athena (issue #1) requiring help from elsewhere (issue #2) while the principal posts on FB (issue #3) ...

To 8:23PM ~~ It wouldn't surprise me.

Anonymous said...

5:48

My child attends Athena and 4 is not the truth. There may have been 4 "fights" but there were as many as 5 more altercations.

The principal called in the police, security from toher schools and the GPD, this was what HE ANNOUNCED TO THE STUDENT BODY!

The prinicpal also addressed the box cutter "report" as false and being spread via the rumor mill, as students did not feel safe and wanted to go home.
Who really knows as obviously past events indicate that the district is less that forthcoming on events such as these.

Anonymous said...

The staff was "informed" that 4 fights, however there were spin off incidents. The school day ended in a 2 period lock down. And fight number one had the middle school and HS in lock down. Box cutters were not USED but reocvered. The fights started the night before at Basil park with many girls fighting one girl NV. Greece hilton...girls.

At school there was a girl fight in which one student that transferred to Athena from Olympia, because of "drama" was injured and went to the hospital. ( pulled hair and blood)

There was video of the fights and the principal called down the student that vidoed the fight only to search her phone and see that it was forwarded to others, they too were called to the office at which time the princpal took the phones and looked through them, one had already deleted the vidoe on the way to the office...

And this moring it is a "police state" at the school, Teachers in every door, some with walkie talkies and security in the hall corners.

Anonymous said...

SCATS, claiming you have a named source who is in a position to know is meaningless. I have a named source who is in a position to know who states that there were 4 fights and no weapons used.

There.

You have been proven wrong.

Unless you think that just because I posted this doesn't make it true. BTW, it is. :P

SCATS said...

To 7:59AM ~~ Please read the comments posted prior to yours. It appears that the staff has once again been hoodwinked (beaten into submission) by administration. Not at all surprising! Maybe someday you will believe how bad our schools have really become. Let's hope it's BEFORE someone gets killed!

Anonymous said...

Is the issue "4 or 8"? Or is the issue "fights"?

Anonymous said...

SCATS, the word you want is faze, not phase.

But yeah, 7 incidents, of which 4 were "fights" (when I was a kid, the operational definition was that it wasn't a fight until someone threw the second punch, either in retaliation or as repetition).

Kids not involved were free to walk past and get to class. If you weren't interested in the fights, the fighters weren't interested in you. Normal stuff.

All of my kids have been through, or are in, Athena. Some fights along the way (not many, none serious). Mostly due to hanging out with the wrong kids (in my kids' case, the children of teachers). Changed the circle of friends, and the problems went away (along with, of course, new problems due to the new friends but not involving Athena anymore).

It's not right, of course, but it's not terribly wrong either. It is human nature and a phase of growing up, which must be monitored and handled calmly and dispassionately.

SCATS said...

To 4:18AM ~~ I think there are several issues which include the large number of fights (at least four, it seems), the fact that other schools SRO's had to be called in to keep the peace and then the fact that admin decided to try to sweep it all under the rug once again.

To 10:49AM ~~ TY! I knew when I wrote it that something was wrong. I couldn't "see" it though.

Let's not minimize the impact of these fights, please. There are times when kids get seriously injured. These days, weapons are more common as are gang-style tactics. Our schools should be made safe, period.

Isn't it time we dislodge the thieves who are stealing services?

Anonymous said...

One of the fights that started in the hall was "pulled" into a class where the students could not get out of the way.
A teacher pulled one girl off the other and into the classroom, where she continued to rage and have explosive behavior.

Based on the other posters definition thre were 4 fights,

Punches and "hits" and some hair pulling, and broken skin that bleed in one case

One boy has been suspended for 4 days and two girls 4 and 5 days.

Parent need to wake up and hold the school accountable for being truthful. They cannot always prevent the "fights" but sure could be honset after the fact.

Anonymous said...

Of course, SCATS, let's not minimize the impact. But let's not presume impact beyond what's in evidence, either. Though there may have been bad fights with serious injuries in the past (I'm not aware, but surely something happened somewhere at some point), were these fights serious and dangerous, or not? By your standard (by "impact") how did these rate? Were there concussions, fractures, stitches, lacerations, abrasions, contusions, or less? Where, by your standard, does pulled hair rate?

Besides, what should the administration be doing that it isn't doing? Do they have it in their power to prevent these fights? I know that you're a big fan of transparency so you'll want to say that the administration should be more forthcoming with reporting details after the fact, but I'm not aware of anything false, misleading, incomplete, or inappropriate in what they told the kids.

SCATS said...

To 2:20PM ~~ How many fights do we need to have before admin tells us there's a problem? How many kids have to be injured before the adults step forward and decide it needs to be addressed? You want to count the NUMBER of stitches as some sort of measure of how serious an altercation was!? REALLY??

What admin should be doing is being much more forthcoming about the nature & number of incidents. They should be sharing with us what they believe is the fuel for these incidents. They should be doing EVERYTHING POSSIBLE to make our schools safe, even if that means BOOTING OUT THOSE STEALING SERVICES!

It's time to take back our schools.

Anonymous said...

Why isn't GPD responding to these fights?
Is GCSD property located outside the Town of Greece, or is there a little agreement between the skrewelz and GPD to hide reality?

Is GCSD now using the City Skrewl System policy of Nobody Calls The Cops?

Sure seems like SumTeengStinks in GCSD.

Anonymous said...

Scats, is there any evidence that the fights are caused by or participated in, by the ones you say are stealing our services? Or are these two different issues?

Anonymous said...

SCATS, your question ("How many fights do we need to have before admin tells us there's a problem?") is ill-posed. There is no numerical criterion. This is basic management theory - read Deming.

Either the administration is doing what it needs to, or it is not. That's why I asked you the question I did. If the administration is doing everything it should, then the level of fights will be whatever it will be - and it won't be zero. On the other hand, if the level of fights turns out to be zero for some period of time, that does not mean that the administration is doing things right. The question of whether the administration is doing things right or not turns on totally separate criteria than how many fights there are. It turns on understanding what the administration is doing, something you're not addressing.

So am I saying that the level of fights doesn't matter? Of course not, it just matters in a different way. It focuses our attention on where we are asking the question (namely what could the administration be doing better). If we had fewer fights, then maybe we'd be asking about fire safety or homosexual inclusion or academic excellence instead of fighting and physical security. The numbers tell us what questions to ask (and what to put on a back burner for a while), where to poke at the administration, but the numbers don't provide the answers. The answers come from understanding what the administration is doing, and what they could be doing instead.

You ask " How many kids have to be injured before the adults step forward and decide it needs to be addressed?". But I have asked, and you have yet to answer, did anyone get injured? Maybe not. You take for granted what you have not yet entered into evidence. Besides, who says it hasn't been addressed, that parents haven't stepped forward? We've talked it through in our home, and we're satisfied with where we stand. Not all action has to come from the administration.

Do I want to count stitches? No. But I want to know whether they happened at all. Three is the same as five to me, but zero is another matter. So was it zero? You claim the inside sources but hide the relevant information.

SCATS said...

To 12:35AM ~~ GPD does respond in the form of using the SRO's. I am pretty sure they will not send any extras unless specifically asked by GCSD to do so.

To 9:50AM ~~ Your bean-counter babble is part of the problem in getting to the core of the troubles in Greece schools, IMHO. The FACT that SRO's had to be sent from one building to another in addition to a multi-period lockdown tells me things were OUT-OF-CONTROL! This is NOT the first time that Athena in particular has been the subject of some sort of out-of-control behavior on the part of the inmates. Remember the episode with the wild drive through the parking lot by a young student where a number of cars were damaged?

Your statement, " If the administration is doing everything it should, then the level of fights will be whatever it will be," is nonsense to those who worry about the safety of sending their kids to school each day. Obviously, you somehow feel insulated from the troubles. Not everyone is so fortunate.

SCATS said...

To 7:14AM ~~ According to a couple of the previous SRO's, yes.

Anonymous said...

To 9:50 YES SOMEONE WAS INJURED>>>>please read other posts that I have made. I understand you may question if my statement is truthful because I am anonymous, but why should I bear the burden of disclosing my name so that the truth be know...this is excatly why I say it is the duty of the admministration to be honest after the fact. I have said they can not "control" the fact that fights do happen, but they lack integrity when they keep it secretive.

One fight One student KM was injured, blood was drawn and copious amount of hair pulled out...

Another fight TT was suspended for 4 days...again this studnt injured another student!

You want proof that quite frankly should not have to be proven here, they shoudl have been acknowledged from Mr Gianotti, after all he did say "I am not going to allow this in MY school..."

Anonymous said...

So SRO's from the other schools were sent to help? Was this done to not make a 911 call and send police? Then this makes it so there wasn't a police report? Then this helps with the cover-ups. It is all in-house. And unless we have people that are staff that leak we wouldn't ever know. Thank you to those that let us know. And phooey to those that want to keep us in the dark.

SCATS said...

To 11:12AM ~~ Yes, that is what I was informed of by a known individual via FB.

Anonymous said...

To 11:11, I have read your posts, that's why I asked SCATS where hair-pulling ranked in the bigger scheme of things. If you had read my posts, you would have noticed that. SCATS is playing coy about what else did or didn't happen, saying that the exact number of stitches doesn't matter, thereby implying that someone got stitches. I called him/her/it on that.

To those of you who think you are being kept in the dark, ask your kids what the school tells them. As best I can tell (and anyone who knows otherwise please share), the school put out reasonable and accurate information to all of the kids. That's alot of kids being told. This is not a cover-up.

So, what are the facts that we know after all of this posting here? A number of incidents took place, perhaps four "fights" (the exact meaning of which is unclear) and an equivalent number of lesser "altercations", also a totally vague label. One person had some hair pulled, enough for their bleeding to be checked out, but apart from that we have nothing that anyone knows of that deserves to be called an "injury".

What else do we know? Contrary to 11:11's claim, I'm not insisting on proof. I'd settle for substantive anonymous descriptions, but we don't even have that. As best we can tell, if everything that is being alleged is true, then one person had some hair pulled. Is there nothing more to this story? And if not, why all of the outrage? And why is the outrage directed at the school, as though the school did something wrong? For instance, some here are up in arms about bringing in help from other schools to Athena. Was that the wrong thing to do? Isn't that what SRO's are for? Isn't this precisely why we pay to place SRO's in the first place? Wouldn't it have been a mistake to not bring over the SROs?

I've asked the question enough times to establish that the refusal to answer is not an oversight: what should the administration have done differently? Isn't it closer to the truth to admit that they did everything correctly? This isn't bean-counter babble (contrary to SCATS's dismissive comment), it is experience. People are hard to manage, teenagers especially. Security is hard to ensure, and incident response is highly procedural. If you have done it, even in settings other than schools, then you know what to expect, roughly, and where to look for errors, if any.

So tell me. Who did what wrong? Who should have done what better?

Anonymous said...

No wonder graduation rates are low. How can students hope to learn anything in these types of environments?

SCATS said...

To 3:17PM ~~ The FACT that security for other schools was pulled to regain order at Athena speaks for itself, despite your determination to downplay and minimize the incidents. I have the "substantive descriptions" but they were put into PRIVATE MESSAGES for me. Since I am trusted, I will not share them with you, sorry.

Obviously, YOU are part of the problem within GCSD. When they don't like the message, they try to minimize it, change the topic, and/or make the person who complained the focus of the negative attention ... just as you have so skillfully attempted to do.

SCATS said...

To 4:26PM ~~ If graduation rates were REALLY on the minds of GCSD employees, then I suspect cell phones (& other similar distractions) which feed into the organization of many such incidents within the schools would be banned.

Anonymous said...

SCATS, I myself have pointed out that " The FACT that security for other schools was pulled to regain order at Athena speaks for itself". I commented on how it demonstrated competence on the part of the administration.

Just because it speaks for itself does not mean that you understand what it is saying. You are free to argue otherwise, but of course you won't. You don't know what you are talking about, and you sense that I do know, so you blow smoke and run for cover. Smart tactics, for the naked and unprepared. OK, not naked, I admit that you are wearing briefs on your face, but still....

What did the administration do wrong? Nothing, as far as you can tell. So stop trying to pretend otherwise. If the messages were so flippin' private you'd do the honorable thing and pretend you never received them. Trying to say "I know you're wrong and I have the proof in my hands but privacy prevents me from saying why" is bovine excreta.

I'm not the problem in GSCD, you are. You say "When they don't like the message, they try to minimize it, change the topic, and/or make the person who complained the focus of the negative attention". Back that up in this case or wait for a case where it might be true. When did the administration try to change the topic here, or point blame at an accuser here, or do anything else corresponding to your hysterical nonsensical childish impertinent agitation?

You provide a valuable service as an aggregator and gossip intermediary, but your personal accusations and opinions are not part of your value offering, to say the least. GSCD administration is doing a competent job, unless you can give us reason to believe otherwise. And if you can't, well, you know the drill...

SCATS said...

To 5:34PM ~~ This will be our LAST exchange since you continue to feel the need to dismiss what many parents feel is important.

You claim calling in Olympia's SRO "demonstrated competence on the part of the administration" but fail to show where that action is the decided one to take. Is it policy? Is it part of the district's safety plan? I THINK NOT! Why not? Simple, it leaves Olympia without the safety of having an SRO on premises!

Why weren't the Greece police called to restore order? Again, simply because admin knows it will end up in the media if a record is made of the problem!!

YOU YOURSELF ARE TRYING TO DISMISS THE IMPORTANCE OF THE MULTIPLE INCIDENTS and take it upon yourself to "agree" to the number of four when various others who are a part of the Athena school population already stated it was perhaps twice that. Does GCSD pay you well for your ability to downplay in hopes of getting all to "forget?"

SCATS said...

BTW 5:34PM ... for someone whose opinion you value so little, you certainly do make a HUGE fuss ;)

Anonymous said...

I agree that 11/10/2013 9:50am sounds like he wants to diminish the incidents. If you think about it, Athena's record for discipline problems involving large numbers of students is part of the history of this blog, isn't it? I mean the archives show lots of problems including the one with the cars in the parking lot last year. Administration hasn't been effective and the kids know it. The adults aren't running things.

Anonymous said...

Oh gee.
We called other SROs in from other schools.
Isn't that what a normal person would do in an emerging brawl situation?
Nobody would call 911 and get cops rolling with the disturbing lights and sirens. That would cause the situation to become commonly known to the Taxpaying public, and GCSD can't have that.

What happens behind school doors stays behind school doors. It's for the children and all that crap. Officer Overtime will keep her mouth shut, after all, she doesn't want to have to do Police work. Nobody got an Ambulance ride.
It Never Happened!
Move along folks, nothing to see here.

Anonymous said...

5:34: So please enlighten us as to WHAT the admin. did after the fights to keep paretns notified of factual events that was in thier control ie a safety plan for the following day...and when and how did they proactivly tell parents what that plan was going to be for Friday? The admin was aware that via social media the fights were "said to continue" on Firday. In the very least a connect ed message should have detailed the plan in advance of Friday. There was a FULL DAY lock down on Friday and what exactly that meant should have been presented to parents before hand...

Anonymous said...

Surprise,the GPD were called and they were a presence the following day also. So to say that the police was not called is egregious. I believe that Admin did everything within their power to squash and suppress any further incidences from occurring. The fact that the school is in protracted lock down shows you that everything has been/is being done to bring back order and normalcy. I will add that it doesn't help the situation with the kids and the use of social media to instigate and arouse disruption at a greater and more destructive pace. This is not the fault of building admin but more importantly the Sup and the BOE with the implementation of the policy last year that allows kids free access to their media devices at all time of the day. This is something that might need to be revisited because of the negative consequences it has created for teachers and administrators.

SCATS said...

To 2:56PM ~~ Interesting that you bring that up. A quick check of the stats shows me that of the Top 10 most viewed BLOGs, 5 are about Athena! This particular thread has already risen to #9 on that list with well over 500 pageviews in just a few days!

To 4:09PM ~~ Do you write comedy? If not, you should ;)

To 5:05PM ~~ Does a full day lockdown convey the idea to you that the adults are in control? Or does it worry you that the situation is tenuous, at best? If I were an Athena parent, I'd be asking some VERY POINTED questions to bldg admin.

To 5:23PM ~~ Sorry but that sounds like a tense situation, not one of "normalcy." I wonder, do students learn better with a police presence ... or without?

I totally agree that the cell phone policy is beyond ridiculous and the root cause of many of these situations involving fights.

SCATS said...

BTW, if they are going to allow the damn phones, they should allow the videos to be made & distributed so we can all see for ourselves how well the BOE policy works.

Anonymous said...

And the LOCKDOWNS continue...for the remainder of the week as per announcements at school. Let me guess, no parents have been informed as to what this means for your student(s) should that need to use the bathroom, got nurse, come to school late, need to stay after school...each of these items (and more) have unique requirements that if student does not meet may be subject to disciplinary action...students that had nothing to do with the fight may be subject to action.
All this for nothing? This should be an indicator of just how bad the situation was...

Anonymous said...

Regardless of how many fights, its getting bad...My two kids went to Arcadia a few years back. I'm sorry we moved to Greece to get away from Gates, we obviously were not thinking straight. As my daughter is starting her next phase in life with possible engagement and buying a home in Greece, i've asked both her and her boyfriend to please not plan on sending my grandchildren to these schools. I'll pay for McQuaid and Mercy if they choose not to move to Victor. Greece is new ghetto, lets face it everyone it is !.. Regardless of race, we have dirtbags moving in and they breed and those kids go to these schools. I feel bad for the good kids just wanted to get an education and get home safely. Oh, and the poo pooing the kids so the parents don't sue, is feeding the frenzy. Stop worrying about the PR and start discipling the bad kids. My son had his share of trouble, but it wasn't a daily fight or bringing in weapons, it was always the screaming parent who whined about being treated unfairly who had the rotten kid and those kids weren't touched. And guess what ? those parents who held their kids accountable, well, those kids got the wrath. Greece schools are screwed up. I wish i could turn the hands of time back...my kids would of NEVER attended Arcacia or Athena - end of story.

SCATS said...

To 4:25PM ~~ While I fully see your point about Greece schools, I wouldn't encourage ANYONE to move to Greece as it currently is. The problems are growing annually. Crime is everywhere. People are being robbed on the sidewalks and in parking lots in certain parts of town. Some businesses keep their doors locked and buzz in their customers. How bad do you think it could get in another 5-10 years??

Anonymous said...

Your 100% right on with your reply Scats. Anyone wonder why we now need 4 town Justices to catch up on the # of cases ? Those aren't small claims tying up our courts, thats for sure. Another 5-10 years, I hope to be out of this town. My own kids won't even shop at Greece Ridge regardless of how hard they are trying to fix it up nice. Ridge road connects to Irondequoit where the trash just drives west. They destroyed that town and the mall, now its ours next. Greece is the next city. Really sad.