Monday, November 22, 2010

2 Incidents, 5 Arrests @Olympia HS Monday

  
2 Female Students, 3 Males Arrested For Fights

"We plan to maintain order in our schools. So, if you're gonna get in a fight, you're gonna get arrested. It's pretty much that simple, there's no place for it in our schools." ~~ Captain Pat Phelan, Greece Police (YNN)

SCATS ~~ Wowie! Capt. Phelan talks as if GPD owns the schools now. Do his kids go there? I suspect not! I'm wondering how this sort of thing can happen TWICE in one day at one school with the SRO's put back into the budget?

43 comments:

Anonymous said...

I was wondering what was going on yesterday about noon. Coming home for lunch and all of a sudden a GPD car comes flying out of Apollo Middle School with its lights and sirens on heading towards Olympia. I saw more flashing lights down by the school. I hope the GPD locked up all the kids involved!

And BTW........there are still a bunch of kids who go to this school who do not live in Greece. All one has to do is monitor the Black Walnut area in the morning and you will see kids jumping out of cars on the side streets and walking to Olympia. Are we that desperate for State Aid that Administration does not care if these kids are legal residents of our community?

Anonymous said...

Rahn exits and Greece goes from being one of the safest communities in America to "just another wannabe".

Walts exits and Greece goes from building a world class school to requiring a police presence to maintain order.

Oh, for the good old days.

Anonymous said...

Somebody's got a promotion coming!

http://tinyurl.com/396ad7j

Anonymous said...

Try going in to the school, then maybe you can talk!

Anonymous said...

At some point you have to question what the regular security people are doing.
It seems to me if in school security was doing their job the police would not be needed.

Anonymous said...

Who is responsible for security within the buildings?
Were the SRO's on duty at the time?
What preventative measures will be instituted
to avoid the same from occurring again?
Will our BOE ask these types of questions
or put their heads in the sand, go hunting,
or concern themselves with more critical
issues like whistleblower hotline updates?

SCATS said...

To 6AM ~~ I've seen the kids walking in LARGE GROUPS down Black Walnut in the afternoons. Now I understand why ... thanks for the insights!

To 6:15AM ~~ It's ALL about image ... or distortion of perception, as the case may be!

To 6:19AM ~~ Talk about ... ??

To 6:32AM ~~ It also seems to me that if the SRO's (cops!) were doing their job, there wouldn't be a need to make arrests twice in a day.

To 7:30AM ~~ Preventative measures?? This is Greece! We have NO SAFETY/GANG PROBLEMS IN OUR SCHOOLS! Ask the Chamber of Commerce, they'll tell ya ;)

SCATS said...

To 6:17AM ~~ Thank you!

Anonymous said...

Are the SROs trained?
If so, by whom?
Are the security guards trained?
If so, by whom?
What role do the building administrators play in preventing these types of incidents?
What happened to Steve A's Safety Committee? Outcomes? Suggestions?
Implementation?

Anonymous said...

We are two and a half months into the school year, and there were five arrests at one of our high schools.

You should hear how some of GPD describe OLHS.

Great job with that sorely-needed, $125,000, emergency inter municipal agreement to reinstate SROS.

But hey, a couple of us got on TV for a night!!!!

SCATS said...

To 8:33AM ~~ You talk as if these are the first arrests that happened since school started. I suspect that assumption is wrong. Ask yourself, with 5 kids arrested in one day after two incidents in one school, how is it that only Time-Warner's news channel got the "news" and told the story? If you don't have cable, it didn't happen ;)

Anonymous said...

We are in for a very long year. The hooligans usually wait until February break for the good weather to return before creating their chaos!

SCATS said...

To 8:58AM ~~ Hooligans? They call them thugs these days ;)

Anonymous said...

As previously posted on this forum, all you need is one mass-casualty incident (which is over usually before police can respond)occur at a school, and you will see parental involvement take on an entirely new meaning.

SCATS said...

To 9:29AM ~~ Even such a horrific event would get sugar-coated and explained away. I can hear Chief Todd telling reporters: "It was an isolated, targeted crime. There's no personal safety worries in Greece on my watch." To which our Supt. will say: "Dittos!"

Anonymous said...

He probably lives in Greece and pays taxes here and thus, like us, he is part owner of the schools. Of course the BOE believes they own them, but...

SCATS said...

To 1:26PM ~~ I suspect you felt it after that 's-t-r-e-t-c-h' ;)

Anonymous said...

Wait a minute I thought if we spent the extra $125,000 we would not have these type of problems.
Was that not what was said at the time when the board approved this money.
I don't recall board members holding people accountable for effectiveness for the money spent.

Anonymous said...

To 2:30 PM It doesn't matter.

This inter municipal agreement was nothing but self-serving, knee-jerk, decision making and political gamesmanship with no BOE oversight or GCSD administrative accountability.

May will be here before we know it. So sad.

SCATS said...

To 2:30PM ~~ You've become another victim in the ongoing game of "GOTCHA!" by our BOE.

To 3:25PM ~~ What do you mean no BOE oversight? THEY INSISTED ON REINSTATING THE SRO'S!! Nobody to blame here but the BOE.

Anonymous said...

To clarify: No oversight since the BOE reinstated them.

Anonymous said...

I have news for you.These fights happen on a weekly basis and many of them stem from outside of school(Facebook and home).This is nothing new.SRO's are not in the building everyday and 1 or 2 officers who are there for a few hours every week cannot be everywhere in the building.Some of these kids don't respect the teachers and guess what they don't listen to the police either.At least the police can arrest them but only if they are 16.The teachers can't do anything but call home or send them to the unit office because they are supposed to be teaching the other 28 students in the class.A growing concern as indicated in the paper last week is that parents need to monitor their child's use of the internet,facebook and their cell phones.They know things are going to happen before school officials do because of their networking.

SCATS said...

To 6:54PM ~~ Actually, fights at Olympia have been happening for the last 15+ years. It's one of the reasons Odyssey worked ... they draw away studentsand families who demand safety first.

Anonymous said...

To 6:54: Your posting a lot of excuses, but offering few solutions.

Anonymous said...

Is it wrong to question wheather building security and administration are doing their jobs?

Anonymous said...

To 8:09 I guess you missed the last sentence.Parents have to talk to their kids and monitor their behavior.Schools can't fix everything.Teachers aren't supposed to be breaking up fights,they're supposed to be teaching.

SCATS said...

To 9:09PM ~~ Absolutely not!

To 9:16PM ~~ God forbid a teacher has to get involved in discipline! Had they done so at lower grades, MAYBE things would be different by the time they got to high school. Since the kids are at school 6 hrs/day, it IS the shool employees job to supervise and discipline is/should be part of that package (just like helping with homework is supposed to be part of the package that parents are expected to participate in ;)

Anonymous said...

"just like helping with homework is supposed to be part of the package that parents are expected to participate in'

Supposed to be is key here. I would be willing to bet that a HUGE majority of students in Greece are NOT getting home support with homework. And... the majority also receive no discipline at home.

SCATS said...

To 9:30PM ~~ Personally, I never signed on for the ridiculous homework projects that the teachers dream up for these kids. I don't think that homework should be tying up a parent's time night after night. School, learning and studying is the job of the student, not the parent. It's the teacher's job to help with that stuff. It's the parent's job to provide a place to study, provide basic help once in awhile, basic supplies, etc. My real point is that helping with homework is no more a parent's job at home than discipline is a teacher's job at school. Since I'm aware Greece teachers want nothing to do with discipline, I think they have no right to complain about the homework help issue ;)

Anonymous said...

SCATS: " It's one of the reasons Odyssey worked ... they draw away studentsand families who demand safety first"

Too bad those kids that can't get into Odyssey are left to try and survive, except now the ratio of good kids has dropped (their over at Odyssey). It's a BS system where those that get in flourish, and the rest are left to die, particularly at Olympia.

Anonymous said...

You really sterotype and draw conclusions here. Have you really met all Greece teachers and know that they want nothing to do with discipline? That is pretty impressive- you must be very busy in all those classrooms every day.

Anonymous said...

I agree that discipline is needed in school and classrooms. No teacher (especially an elementary teacher) can keep any kind of sanity without discipline. However, discipline does start at home. Or at least it should! Who should break up fights at school should not even be a question? The fact is there should NEVER be a fight at school or at the mall or anywhere else for that matter. I would have never even thought about getting into a physically fight with someone. It is not because my teachers told me that fighting was bad, it was because I was raised in a way where I knew that was wrong. We can keep placing blame on the teachers, or the district, or the resource officers but that will never solve the problems. Parents need to teach their children right from wrong. That doesn't begin when a child enters kindergarten, that begins at birth!

SCATS said...

To 9:59PM ~~ It is a tragedy!

To 10:02PM ~~ You're funny! When have you ever heard a Greece teacher either address the BOE about discipline problems, or step up and take intervene in the schools? In my many years of watching this district, I've yet to ever see/hear of the former and seldom see/hear about the latter. If it's not in the contract, it doesn't happen ;)

To 10:22PM ~~ I thought district employees signed on with the idea that it takes a whole village. Apparently, I'm wrong about that!

Anonymous said...

In another thread SCATS was bragging about teaching children colors, but now SCATS seems to think that teaching children not to fight is too challenging for parents and not to be expected. But that does make sense. Colors are easier...

Anonymous said...

UNION teachers negotiated away any and all disciplinary responsibility in the 1970s, and have had no responsibility for discipline since.

In the mid to late 70s many Districts employed Disciplinarians based on the Catholic School model to deal with student problems referred by UNION teachers. As money tightened up in the 80s the Disciplinarians were eliminated.

Hell, the UNION teachers are barely competent to find their classrooms let alone instruct, what do any of them know about discipline, or getting respect from their room full of munchkins?

The Columbine hysteria gave Districts the ability to lock down and keep parents and the general public from seeing what happens in the building, and that makes Administration happy as long as Ambulances aren't needed.

Now school employees run scared of kids with cell cameras and recorders.

Charlie Hubbard said...

There are no disipline problems as I have heard nothing from the gta when they have spoken in front of the board.
Would this not be what the slot on the agenda for the gta is for?
For that matter I have heard no ideas for improvements coming from the gta ---- I wonder why.

SCATS said...

To 10:38AM ~~ It wasn't "bragging" but merely a statement of fact ;)

To Charlie ~~ And I doubt we ever will hear anyone from GTA speak about discipline or school improvement. It speaks volumes, doesn't it?

Anonymous said...

Police have less authority in the schoolhouse than do administrator. Police officers have zero authority and cannot act without administration assistance.

SCATS said...

To 12:25AM ~~ In Greece, it appears that GPD has always "gone along" with whatever GCSD wanted. Thus, the phony "completed investigations" with no one to charge after the Athena wrestling team's abuse of a kid, the pilfering of building materials via the Building & Grounds folks for the benefit of a church and other such scandals over the years. Rahn's absence makes little difference.

Anonymous said...

""Police have less authority in the schoolhouse than do administrator. Police officers have zero authority and cannot act without administration assistance.

11/25/2010 12:25 AM ""

REALLY?
Would you be so kind as to cite an authority for that statement!

Schools may act in the manner of believing such crap, but the reality is different, unless the police are flat refusing to do their job.

Anonymous said...

The police have the authority in the schools and it is good that they use it. They do not need administrative permission, for example some years back at Athena one principal was told to "step out " of the situation or he would go out in handcuffs too. As for whose job it is to discipline kids, it is parent, teacher and administrator. The problem is not with just one of the three. We have a small percentage of the population whose parents think littly suzy has the right to use her cell phone, swear and act horribly. Ask any teacher at the high schools and they can name the 15-30 kids at each grade level that are most likely to be in on the fights and other issues. Why, well because they have been in on them before and have been brought back to school after a few days off. Until Greece uses an alternative school or after hours school (like the city) these kids will continue to cause problems during the regular school day. this isn't a finger pointing issue, everyone involved owns a piece the saddest part is that nothing gets done because in greece we don't take these students out of the mainstream school. Now, how about we take the "superior" kids out of odyssey and send them back to their homeschool and use the staff there for our behavior issue kids. They are so wonderful that they should be able to turn them all around and still get on the top 100 schools list right???? Shouldn't cost us a dime more.

Anonymous said...

To SCATS regarding:
"SCATS said...
To 10:02PM ~~ You're funny! When have you ever heard a Greece teacher either address the BOE about discipline problems, or step up and take intervene in the schools? In my many years of watching this district, I've yet to ever see/hear of the former and seldom see/hear about the latter. If it's not in the contract, it doesn't happen ;)"

Just who do you think breaks up the fights then and creates the safety plans? I'll tell you - It's the admin team and teachers. Teachers and admin do care. They go way above and beyond their contracts daily, they certainly aren't doing it for the fame and fortune!

Teachers do stop fights because they are there. The kids are cunning, they plan fights ahead of time, they know where security is and where the SRO is or is not, they take out their cell phones and txt even when the policy is they shouldn't be used or even seen. But sometimes fights start right in front of security and SROs, they are not mind readers, nor do they eavesdrop on the conversations of 200 kids in a cafeteria. They are not superman and do not have x-ray vision. They work hard IN schools trying to educate our misguided (often by media or parental figures) youth and prevent harm, which is more than I can say for many of you all on here writing all day long - stop being a part of the problem and be a part of the solution. In the words of MARK TWAIN: “Action speaks louder than words but not nearly as often”


TO 11/28/2010 11:28 AM:
I totally agree with "Now, how about we take the "superior" kids out of odyssey and send them back to their homeschool and use the staff there for our behavior issue kids. They are so wonderful that they should be able to turn them all around and still get on the top 100 schools list right???? Shouldn't cost us a dime more."

In fact we should go back to neighborhood schools for everyone and use Barnard and Odessey for alternatives - get the kids out of the mall...that is clearly not working.


Also, is 11/23/2010 6:00 AM really that ignorant that just because a kid jumps out of a car on a street adjacent to the school that they must not live in greece? I was dropped off at school almost every day when I was in hs and lived within a mile of the school. And really are you insinuating that these particular students bring in aditional state aid - really? How is it that you know their economic status? Sadly, you have the same qualities as some of the kids fighting - ignorance and lack of respect for others!!!

SCATS said...

To 10:12PM ~~ Breaking up fights is NOT the same as presenting the school board with information saying that discipline in the schools is problemmatic, is it? In fact, I thought we have security guards AND SRO's to do this so teachers don't have to get involved. IF teachers are intervening in fights, then you do yourselves a disservice by not bringing this topic up for discussion in a community forum setting.

I completely agree that the mall location for dealing with kids is not working. In fact, I think it is helping to drag the mall down fast.

As for the students who catch rides or jump out of cars ~~ I've seen groups of students doing this on certain side streets adjacent to the middle and high schools. It does look VERY suspicious. I don't believe they are related but are stealing services by attending our schools when they reside outside the district. Isn't it odd that we've heard NOTHING about theft of services since Buckman Hts. inappropriately targeted that boy who was living at the Extended Stay Hotel? I recall that we were told that over 20 cases were under investigation at the time. What happened? Where do things stand now? Does anyone pay any attention to this problem?