Wednesday, June 02, 2010

How Safe Is Greece Ridge Mall?

Are we becoming the next Irondequoit mall?

In recent times, mall owners instituted a curfew to keep groups of teens from hanging out & causing trouble on weekends, especially in the movie theater and food court areas.

Now, the Festival For Youth has been shut down permanently.

YNN reports: Despite public opinion, police said this mall is a safe place to be. "Obviously the event yesterday isn't going to help the perception, but the reality is the crime at the mall is very low." ~~  Greece Police Capt. Steve Chatterton. "I don't go there a lot just because of the people that are there and the security that's around the mall. It's just not a fun place to be anymore." ~~ Arieal Brown, 20.

SCATS ~~ "Despite" public opinion??? What the heck does that mean? If people don't feel safe, then it isn't safe and people will stay away. I know many folks who no longer go to the mall in the evenings specifically because they do NOT feel safe. Telling them that the statistics don't support their feelings won't change their minds!


Anonymous said...

Maybe "crime at the mall is very low" because the police choose to not arrest people that commit crimes (like fighting in public), or the police are not very good at their job and cannot solve the crimes or apprehend the criminals.
It sounds like the recent incident pointed out that when faced by a large group of "youths" the Greece police back down.
This probably did not go unnoticed by the baby kingpins of crime. They see our mall as a very attractive place to transact business. Wilmorite will be so pleased.
Another concern. When the police loaded up the buses from the city to send the crowd back home, was their any security on those buses or were the drivers completely in charge? If that is the case maybe we should look to those brave drivers to work in our police force. Maybe city kids respect/fear them more than our police.

Anonymous said...

I only go to the greece mall at times when teen population is low. Otherwise, i wait for the weekend and make the trek to Eastview. Most telling was on the news the police officer stated the trouble abated when the RTS buses pulled up and people left.... Maybe, we should have arrested a few to show that coming to Greece and behaving badly has some consequences. Otherwise, we just opened the door and made our community a doormat.

Anonymous said...

I am one who runs into the store I need to visit and then drives around to another store. I refuse to walk thru the mall with my kids and be subject to the crass behavior and rude mobs of kids wandering aimlessly.

SCATS said...

To 12:52PM ~~ There are VERY FEW mall stores that I frequent in Greece these days. When I absolutely, positively have to go, I do the same as you. I've worked it this way since they combined the two malls together, the first step in their loss of control over what happens at the mall and in the parking lot.

Anonymous said...

This is certainly an interesting topic, but there are several points that need to be addressed.

1) Using resources to arrest 1 or even 10 people would not be practical. The PD did a good job in dispersing the crowd with what limited resources they had. Fight related arrests often do not warrant serious charges unless serious injury occurs.

2) Backup from several departments did come to the scene. You also have to realize this came during the shift GPD is busiest and there are other priority calls.

3) If this related (and it is assumed it was) to the Seabreeze incident, shouldn't RPD have passed this information on to other departments? It is not the responsibility of GPD to keep tabs in city kids as we all know there are enough problem kids in Greece.

4) It is obvious Greece is a big town and crime will occur. The town police patrol sectors were recently re-drawn in the past year and the mall is now virtually its own patrol area, along with an officer detailed to the mall. With no real mall in the city, GPD can't do much in deciding what population shows up there. They do maintain a visible presence there and are pretty good at responding to incidents and making arrests when they occur.

Just some thoughts to ponder over...

SCATS said...

BLOG Administration has rejected publishing a one line racist comment.

To 2:12PM ~~ What makes arresting the instigators of violence "impractical?"

Regarding who shows up at the mall: no one has mentioned that our mall houses an "alternative high school" for all intents and purposes. Of course, I'm sure none of those kids would ever cause trouble outside of school at the mall ;)

Anonymous said...

When I go to Greece Ridge Mall I carry a LEGAL firearm for protection. However I rarely walk the mall either. I have seen several kids "sporting" box cutting razors. Greece Ridge Mall is already the on the same path as Irondequoit Mall.

Anonymous said...

The increased security in fact increases insecurity as surveillance often does.
The curfew is a terrible idea as it makes for more police surveillance of the majority of innocent kids making everyone uncomfortable.

If you are so fearful of the darker races -- and that is the hidden text here-- you should lobby to have actual shopping in the city where people live. Everyone has to shop for stuff somewhere. It might help if shoppers of all ethnicities who want to spend money in Greece were made to feel welcome. It might go a long way toward self-policing

Where are folks supposed to go?

SCATS said...

To 4:35PM ~~ I don't think it's actually people who come here to shop who are creating the problems. More often, I think it's teens with nowhere else to go who come to hangout with friends and end up creating trouble.

By the way, based upon the 5PM news on Ch 10, it sounds like there were two gangs that caused the festival shutdown on Monday night. Each group was wearing their own colors & police say they broke up into two distinct groups based upon those colors as they left.

Anonymous said...

To 2:12 I disagree with your position in one way ,"It is not the responsibility of GPD to keep tabs in city kids as we all know there are enough problem kids in Greece."
Indeed it is not the Greece Police problem what city kids do or plan to do in the city. In fact it is not the Greece Police business to ascertain what greece or gates kids do in the city.
But it is the Greece Police business to keep the town of greece safe and to tell through whatever means possible when there will be a problem here. Knowing that Sea Breeze had closed because of a planned fight at an amusement park should have put the greece police on watch that the planned fight could have been moved. After all, the gangs may have their own territories but they can take their fights anywhere that is convenient. Obviously they wanted a lot of attention so they chose Sea Breeze. Like cockroaches in one apartment that are evicted, they move.

Anonymous said...

It seems that alot of the people that I need to support through tax dollars have idle time to wander malls. They are to business what zebra mussels are to lakes. They infest an area, bringing no worth, and eventually kill off the once thriving ecosystem that was business. The recent article about businesses by the Liberty Pole is a prime example. Midtown, Irondiqouit Mall and soon Charlotte Beach and our own mall. They are useless, but nobody wants to say it.

Anonymous said...

Baxter knows this, so does Auberger. You should too!


Without even thinking about it, we take it as a given that the police must protect each of us.
That's their whole reason for existence, right? While this might be true in a few jurisdictions in
the US and Canada, it is actually the exception, not the rule. In general, court decisions and
state laws have held that cops don't have to do a thing to help you when you're in danger.
In the only book devoted exclusively to the subject, Dial 911 and Die, attorney Richard W.
Stevens writes:
It was the most shocking thing I learned in law school. I was studying Torts in my first year
at the University of San Diego School of Law, when I came upon the case of Hartzler v. City
of San Jose. In that case I discovered the secret truth: the government owes no duty to
protect individual citizens from criminal attack. Not only did the California courts hold to
that rule, the California legislature had enacted a statute to make sure the courts couldn't
change the rule.
But this doesn't apply to just the wild, upside down world of Kalifornia. Stevens cites laws and
cases for every state — plus Washington DC, Puerto Rico, the Virgin Islands, and Canada -
which reveal the same thing. If the police fail to protect you, even through sheer incompetence
and negligence, don't expect that you or your next of kin will be able to sue.
Even in the nation's heartland, in bucolic Iowa, you can't depend on 911. In 1987, two men broke
into a family's home, tied up the parents, slit the mother's throat, raped the 16-year-old daughter, and
drove off with the 12-year old daughter (whom they later murdered). The emergency
dispatcher couldn't be bothered with immediately sending police to chase the
kidnappers/murders/rapists while the abducted little girl was still alive. First he had to take calls
about a parking violation downtown and a complaint about harassing phone calls. When he got
around to the kidnapping, he didn't issue an all-points bulletin but instead told just one officer to
come back to the police station, not even mentioning that it was an emergency. Even more
blazing negligence ensued, but suffice it to say that when the remnants of the family sued the city
and the police, their case was summarily dismissed before going to trial. The state appeals court
upheld the decision, claiming that the authorities have no duty to protect individuals.

SCATS said...

To 1:56AM ~~ Thank you for the reminder. I think I read about that a long time ago. It IS eye-opening.

Anonymous said...

And they can't be held accountable for putting a man in prison due to a coerced confession. Even the DA gets to skate for that.
So we should all have hired bodyguards? Maybe the gated communities with their rent a cops have the right idea. We could get together in each neighborhood and chip in like we do for plow service in the winter. Of course if those guys did anything wrong they could be sued. That's what insurance is for.
At the next town board meeting we could all show up with our special security staff.

Anonymous said...

I guess an effective police force is too socialist a concept for a good Republican town like Greece.

10:39's philosophy is the logical outcome of tea-party-ish thinking.